“There is a scenario of a dark side within the GNU that is going to do everything possible to break this Government of National Unity.” That is the warning from Neil De Beer, the President of United Independent Movement (UIM). In this interview with BizNews, he reacts to charges that Democratic Alliance (DA) Federal Chair Helen Zille is acting like a “parallel” president and endangering the GNU. De Beer says a possible collapse of the GNU “is going to have to be something that will have to be discussed and I’m telling you right now, the DA, the Freedom Front, the IFP and all partners are absolutely also talking daily, in my opinion, about that scenario, which is the worst case.” De Beer also gives his take on President Cyril Ramaphosa’s opening address to Parliament; former Intelligence Minister Lindiwe Sisulu’s statement that basically everybody was bugged; as well as the growing threat of international criminal cartels which are “the kind of people that put heads on stakes and bodies on top of your house”.
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Highlights from the interview
In a recent interview with Chris Steyn for BizNews, Neil De Beer, President of the United Independent Movement, discussed significant concerns regarding South Africa’s intelligence and crime issues. De Beer highlighted former Minister of Intelligence Lindiwe Sisulu’s shocking admission that the government had bugged its citizens, an acknowledgement of a severe breach of privacy and a criminal act. He criticized the inadequate allocation of only 4% of the total police budget to Crime Intelligence, underscoring the lack of seriousness in addressing the nation’s security challenges.
De Beer also compared South Africa’s growing drug problem to Colombia’s infamous narcotics history under Pablo Escobar. He noted recent drug busts involving international suspects, such as Mexicans and Russians, which indicate the presence of organized crime cartels rather than mere gangs. These cartels are highly organized and violent, posing a new level of threat to the country.
He expressed hope that the country’s Police Intelligence would rise to the challenge and called for individuals with honour and loyalty to combat this scourge. De Beer concluded with a dire warning about the evolving nature of crime in South Africa and the need for effective intelligence and security measures to protect its citizens.
Extended transcript of the interview ___STEADY_PAYWALL___
00:00:11:20 – 00:00:22:14
Chris Steyn:
The first Parliament of the new Government of National Unity has gone into session. We speak to Neil De Beer, the President of the United Independent Movement. Welcome, Neil.
00:00:22:16 – 00:00:38:04
Neil De Beer:
Ja, good day, Chris and to the BizNews fraternity. What a week on many fronts, on many sides, and some algorithms now showing up in the country on various matters that are very interesting indeed.
00:00:38:06 – 00:00:43:21
Chris Steyn:
So we start with President Cyril Ramaphosa’s first address to Parliament.
00:00:43:23 – 00:01:15:05
Neil De Beer:
Now the minute I listened to it, a song came up which meant the words reflected in my mind, Hello darkness, my old friend. And I actually said, Hello Cyril, my old friend. Chris, it was as if he got up and became the president for the first time. It’s as if his time as vice-president and his presidency in the previous five years were an absolute obliteration of his mind.
00:01:15:07 – 00:01:44:02
Neil De Beer:
But I said to the people that I’m going to listen to this SONA address in a very positive light. I will not look for the negatives. I will no doubt look at the positives. Because the Government of National Unity is a fact. It has cracks, but it is the de facto new government, and we must support it as patriots.
00:01:44:04 – 00:02:22:20
Neil De Beer:
But when you go and start listening to what he is saying, I am sorry to say, Chris, it is something we have heard many times over. Every time he talks about projects and programs. But funny enough, he never says in his speech what they’ve done. So the president of this country should reflect on what he achieved in the previous year, and then tell us what his goal is as the chief executive of this country for the next year.
00:02:22:22 – 00:03:00:06
Neil De Beer:
There was none. There was no reflection on what was promised and what was done by his government and what he is promising. Now he addressed matters of attacking energy, creating 2 million jobs and more, telling us that he acknowledges that every Metro – except for one; funny enough, Cape Town – is moer toe. He acknowledges that Johannesburg, Pretoria, Ekhuruleni, eThekwini, even Mangaung, Bloemfontein, PE, that they are gone.
00:03:00:08 – 00:03:27:00
Neil De Beer:
And he acknowledges as if he has just found that out. So that was a shocking shame to sit there and say, but where have you been? So every time I looked at him saying, we are going to bring connectivity, we are going to beneficiate our minerals, we are going to look at redressing rail, but you as the ANC made it unsustainable.
00:03:27:02 – 00:03:58:22
Neil De Beer:
And then the classic is when he says to us that the failure in actual fact of the country’s infrastructure is because they didn’t maintain it. Yes, you didn’t maintain it. So, from an intelligence background, not IQ, but information, and having the understanding, for example, how the KGB works; they always train to say, don’t listen to what a person says,
00:03:59:00 – 00:04:34:10
Neil De Beer:
focus on what they’re not saying. So going into that understanding, I listened to what this president, Soekie Cyril, was not saying. And I was watching the reaction of the new Government of National Unity people sitting there like little fur seals on a rock and seeing a dolphin do a loop-de-loop and doing this…(clapping). What a stark change. What a yin and yang from the previous scenario where, for instance, people like John Steenhuisen, people like Pieter Groenewald,
00:04:34:11 – 00:05:05:06
Neil De Beer:
they would go… No? To (clapping). So they didn’t have a choice. And then no disturbance in SONA. No EFF march, no EFF radical, no MK explosion. Just total silence. And that was their strategy – without a doubt. So what did he say that shocked me? None of the above, except he said we are going to build an ethical state, Chris, an ethical state. He’s going to build an ethical state
00:05:05:08 – 00:05:40:18
Neil De Beer:
Chris, an ethical state. He’s going to build an ethical state and he’s going to fight corruption. Therefore, is he saying under ethical state, Phala Phala will be brought back for a thorough public investigation? VBS will be slaughtered and also unpacked, that the Zondo Commission will at final time now show the high-level arrests. Because that’s an ethical state. Funny, the four things he didn’t speak about…
00:05:40:20 – 00:06:10:17
Neil De Beer
No address of BEE, which is a failure, and which the opposition party said they will absolutely cancel when they come into power. Nothing about foreign policy. This is the first time in about six deliveries of a president where nothing of foreign policy was discussed and is missing at the SONA. Why? Well, there they sit (clapping) because they can’t speak about Russia,
Read more: De Beer: Trump, Malema, Zuma – what’s next…
00:06:10:17 – 00:06:38:13
Neil De Beer
Ukraine and they definitely cannot speak about Palestine, Israel. So shocking on that basis. The BELA Bill, which we all know is ridiculous, no mention of it. And here’s a sad thing, Chris, de facto, this president is the Commander in Chief of the National Defense Force. It was weird to me that in COVID time he would come in a dressage of an aangeplakte
00:06:38:13 – 00:07:21:18
Neil De Beer
Pep store’s uniform to command the soldiers to come protect the citizens against the virus. But at SONA he said nothing about the recent deaths of a multitude of our National Defense Force soldiers beyond our border. I found that severely disappointing when we just this week buried another major, another officer who died on duty.
And then lastly, Chris. The speech that was there was kind of, I said, it’s SONA without sonar.
00:07:21:20 – 00:07:45:17
Neil De Beer
And one can only pray that every minister who is now sitting there in the GNU will get our support. But we are watching them because they’ve now been given the might, the sword, the power, and the so-called vote. 100 days started this week. So let’s not kill it. Let us not do it. Let us not drown it.
00:07:45:19 – 00:07:52:15
Neil De Beer
Let’s wait in anticipation, hopefully, that the GNU will work. But I’m sorry, Chris, the cracks are there.
00:07:52:17 – 00:08:00:22
Chris Steyn
Well, meanwhile, Helen Zille has been accused of acting like a parallel president. Do you think she is doing that?
00:08:01:00 – 00:08:43:09
Neil De Beer
For the third time. You know, they say in baseball you get three strikes. So firstly, Fikile said that, then Cyril said that, and now Gwede says that. With all of them, you have to take a little bit of a pinch of aromat salt and a touch of pepper. But at the end of the day, the fact that the Secretary General of the ANC, the President of the ANC, and the Chairman of the ANC is continually on record saying that Helen Zille is a huge thorn in the GNU side. This is showing you that there is a disparity, a split between the powers in the GNU of what they want to do.
00:08:44:08 – 00:09:03:15
Neil De Beer
must do, but surely don’t want to do. And I said that in my previous analysis, which is true, there is a scenario of a dark side within the GNU that are going to do everything possible to break this Government of National Unity.
00:09:03:17 – 00:09:10:22
Chris Steyn
And if they succeeded, who would be waiting in the wings to take the place of the Democratic Alliance?
00:09:11:00 – 00:09:37:10
Neil De Beer
You see Chris, this is interesting. Because you know the old stereotyping that the DA is a white party, it is a supremacist party, it is Verwoerd speaking, it is that conclave, and then you get the ANC, which is the communistic, socialistic scenario. Now you’ve got the MK and a grouping of EFF sitting and saying that they are the official opposition. What? Anyway. They are the official opposition.
00:09:37:12 – 00:10:16:23
Neil De Beer
If this GNU, which I now refer to as the canoe, if they are going to start punching holes into this canoe and this thing starts to wobble and like in the first ever GNU in 1994, the people leave the ship. There’s only two ways this is going to go. Parties are going to disintegrate or parties are going to amalgamate. In the ’94 GNU, the Apartheid system, through the National Party, who then called themselves the New National Party under
00:10:17:00 – 00:10:53:01
Neil De Beer
Kortbroek Marthinus, decided to switch the lights off of the National Party. FW walked into the sunset and they absolutely folded themselves into the ANC. And he became Minister of Tourism. And by the way, that’s not a very difficult task. So, it is going to have to be something that will have to be discussed and I’m telling you right now, the DA, the Freedom Front, the IFP and all partners are absolutely also talking daily, in my opinion, about that scenario, which is the worst case scenario.
00:10:53:03 – 00:11:02:22
Chris Steyn:
Well, Neil, this week we had to hear the former Minister of Intelligence, Lindiwe Sisulu, tell us that we were all bugged. Were we?
00:11:03:00 – 00:11:34:18
Neil De Beer:
Basically. She was not just the Minister of Intelligence, which is now a conundrum, but she was also the Minister of Defence. Now, if you have, in the scale of, can I call it critical ministries in the cabinet, I know I worked around and in. Here are two ministries with respect that you can give people if you don’t want something to dramatically happen to the country, you give it to them.
00:11:34:20 – 00:11:52:06
Neil De Beer:
One is Sports, Arts and Culture and the other one is Tourism. Nou gaan jy vir mense almal sê: Dit is Tafelberg. They know it’s Tafelberg, so you don’t have to do much in the Minister of Tourism. God created the stunning places and you just tell people it’s there. Sports, Arts and Culture. Hoe moer to kan jy dit maak? I mean, the Springboks win,
00:11:52:06 – 00:12:35:16
Neil De Beer:
the Springboks lose. We fight, we go on. Soccer wins, soccer loses. So when you look at those ministries, and it’s not a slap in anybody’s face, it’s just reality, they are not what you call critical ministries. In our scenario, essential ministries are: Education, Health, Defence, Finance, and Police. And that little one that’s kind of disappeared…State Security. The day that the Presidency, a couple of years ago, took the Ministry of State Security and put it under the Presidency
00:12:35:18 – 00:13:09:20
Neil De Beer:
That was an algorithm. Ooh. So now what we’ve got is we’ve got this understanding that a minister, a fully-fledged Minister of Intelligence, the pre-entity before it became State Security acknowledged it at an Independent media presser – where, by the way, they also exposed this little other thing called Goolam MV and they got the wrong guy who’s now suing them for 1.2 million.
00:13:09:22 – 00:13:41:19
Neil De Beer:
It shows you what kind of intelligence was in the room and there’s a retired Minister of Intelligence Lindiwe Sisulu who comes from ANC royalty – and how the mighty have fallen, who says on record, we bugged everybody. And then she comes and says, basically. Now hear me, Chris, you are either pregnant or you are not pregnant. You cannot be half pregnant.
00:13:41:21 – 00:14:12:03
Neil De Beer:
Now you either bugged us or you didn’t. So, my watching the portfolio, the face, I’m telling you when she said, but you know, we bugged everybody, I think her brain went, huh? Now, hy’s uit; jy kan hom nie terug sit nie…and it’s media. So I think she tried to regain that by saying, we bugged everybody…basically. That is an acknowledgment, by the way,
Read more: De Beer: GNU – The rocky pillar is… the ANC
00:14:12:05 – 00:14:39:13
Neil De Beer:
of a crime. And the only person that spoke about it was a Press Release by the Presidency to say: This cannot be true and this never happened and we deny it. But your minister just acknowledged that you bugged people. So wow, algorithm, I wonder if anybody is going to ask her: Who did you bug? When did you get that authority? And who issued the warrant?
00:14:39:15 – 00:14:42:13
Neil De Beer:
Interesting, I don’t think that thing should go away.
00:14:42:15 – 00:15:06:21
Chris Steyn:
Neil, while we are on intelligence, I want to take you to the organised crime syndicates. How is it ever going to be possible to break the cartels while the kingpins are informing for the intelligence services, which is a brilliant way to protect themselves and their businesses? And they just, you know, throw the services, the names of rivals or minions they no longer have a use for?
00:15:06:23 – 00:15:42:04
Neil De Beer:
Because this is a… and if we could just wait one minute on this and spend a minute on this. This is huge. You can see my facial expression is changing. This is a huge factor that has just appeared on the radar. About a year and a half ago, Chris, I made a public presentation on crime, but more on the side of the Crime Intelligence, and shocking again to the budget of Police.
00:15:42:06 – 00:16:11:15
Neil De Beer:
Do you know what is the total percentage that they have decided to spend on the total more than 100 billion budget on Crime Intelligence, Chris? 4% of the total Police budget this year is on intelligence. Rêrig? You think they’re taking this seriously? It’s like the military budget of 53 billion and 32 billion is on salaries.
00:16:11:17 – 00:16:13:00
Chris Steyn:
I was going to ask you that.
00:16:13:01 – 00:16:32:00
Neil De Beer:
Chris, we have just seen something happen. A massive drug bust outside, where they found most probably the largest drug factory in the southern African hemisphere,
00:16:32:02 – 00:16:33:01
Chris Steyn:
2 billion rand.
00:16:33:01 – 00:17:08:17
Neil De Beer:
valued at more than two billion rand. But interestingly, when they arrested them, two Mexicans. They just, two weeks ago, arrested another group of people. A Russian. And two weeks ago, my speech of a year-and-a-half ago came true when I said South Africa has become Colombia. And everybody went, what do you mean? I said, follow the history of Pablo Escobar and what he did to Colombia.
00:17:08:18 – 00:17:47:10
Neil De Beer:
We are becoming that and wragtig, true as gold as the sun came up, we had a major, major scenario in the Western Cape: Colombians and drugs. Now hear me well, Chris. The difference between a gang and a cartel is chalk and cheese. This is a crime gang with turbo juice. Because a cartel is a different organization, a different structure, a different level of working.
00:17:47:12 – 00:18:31:07
Neil De Beer:
These are people that don’t run around like gangs. They are organized and they are ferocious. They are the kind of people that put heads on stakes and bodies on top of your house. This is a different level that is now entering the crime scenario in this country. It is shocking. It is frightening. And I hope that our Police Intelligence are absolutely geared to now understand that South Africa has now fallen to another level internationally of the dark side.
00:18:31:09 – 00:18:59:22
Neil De Beer:
And I pray that we have people that have absolute honor, that have absolute loyalty. En daai goetjies wat benodig word om die lig te bring. Because if you don’t have this, this, and that, you are not going to be able to eradicate this new scourge that we will need to protect our citizens from without a doubt.
00:19:00:00 – 00:19:07:01
Chris Steyn:
Thank you. That was Neil de Beer, President of United Independent Movement, speaking to BizNews, and I’m Chris Steyn.
Read also:
De Beer: GNU – The End Game
DE BEER: The GNU – Racism, Factionalism & Power
RW Johnson: The new opposition emerges
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